Be Excellent To Each Other

Thank you, Sir. I'm always happy to write and also answer any questions, should they pop up.
Agree with you about Myp, by the way.

You can hear from me as much as you want

As far as the hernia is concerned, I think it's relatively routine, even with a whopper like this. I've told them I won't do it without a general anaesthetic, though. Strangely enough I'm more worried about the examination by the surgeon to decide what technique he will choose. My GP had a good prod and knead and that hurt like hell for days.

Anyway, thanks for the best wishes and hopefully a Happy New Year (that applies to all of you, btw).

Cheers Kern.

With the Hamilton thing, that's one of the positives in this situation - you end up paying more attention to things you might not have looked twice at in the past. In other words, it's not all bad - mostly, but not all.

Jeez, I'm now down to quoting myself...but the Hamilton musical has become my "happy place", getting me through dark times - must have watched/listened to it a dozen times and it's absolutely dripping with genius. I can't recommend it enough.

Hamilton is on our list to watch.

Like many people, I've done Dry January this year.

I think it's the first time I've gone without a drink for longer than a week for 20-odd years.

I've found the weekends dragging, I must confess, even though there's no going out to be done, but it has thrown into sharp refresh how habitual my drinking was.

Lockdown obviously exacerbated the situation, but I got to drinking every night, often without deriving any pleasure from it.

I will definitely drink again (he promises) but I will be doing so which a much greater awareness and control (I hope).

I hope I played even a tiny role in this, it would mean alot.

As for Hamilton, you can see a good version of the stage show on (a slightly less than legal PC app - I'm sure you know what I mean, it's Kodi, sorry kinda obvious).

You certainly did! I've found myself reflecting a lot on your comments about the creeping nature of alcohol abuse, and how normal it can feel, belying the damage it may be doing to you. Thank you

Hey Mr C. I always want to reply to this thread but don’t always know what to say. I guess I just want to say that I’m reading along and admire you greatly. I don’t drink at all, but (and partly because) I’ve seen people’s lives ruined by alcohol in various (but in my experience mostly violent) ways, and not just the person with the alcoholism, so every time I read here and seeing so many people responding to say they’ve taken stock and put stoppers in place to stop that creeping normalising of it as part of routine lifestyle I feel admiration and gratitude that you are sharing your journey.

Sorry, those sentences are horribly constructed. I’m sure there’s a proofreader and editor around here somewhere. I hope you get the sense of what I mean, though. xx

You can't believe how delighted I am to hear that. Thank you and well done, Sir. You're spot on when you say it can feel normal, but abuse it certainly is.

Yeah they were some dodgy sentences, but I'm always delighted to hear from you. I'd be happy to take on the role of proofreader, one bag of Wotsits an hour would seem to be a reasonable fee. Plus maybe some pickled onions, I am hooked on those again.

I thank you for the admiration, coming from a forum member that I greatly respect. Maybe you can knit me a new liver...sorry, my sense of humour is all over the place, but keeps me and my wife going.

I will continue to share, as long as there are people to listen. I'm relieved to be able to say my own alcoholism was never violent. Not what you'd call a big boast, but better than nothing.

At the moment I'm focussed on the upcoming hernia examination and the following op. Goes without saying I'm terrified, but I think I have the mental strength to get through it.

And you lot have helped make that possible - I can't repeat that often enough.

For you Mimi, we both send or love for you and yours, your coments have been a huge help for which I say than you again xx

Sorry to drag this up again, but the fact is my wife is at work and I need someone to talk to, even if nothing comes back.

To sum up, I'm at my limit and simply don't know what to do.

I'm in constant pain with the hernia (forget all the liver-related stuff, it's of course still there). I had an appointment with a surgeon last Wednesday, expecting an appointment for surgery, but she very clearly ruled out an op because of my ascites and blood results and said I should go through another withdrawal in hospital, despite the fact that I'm not drinking and didn't have any withdrawal therapy in 2015 (I sorted it for myself via cold turkey).

She said she needed to see much lower levels of ascites, (maybe doable with drainage), and better blood results, which seems like mission impossible as they have been at current levels throughout my abstention time. I simply can't see how I can change that.

And here's the scary shit - she told me if the hernia causes a blockage/obstruction it would require an emergency op with what she described as a "very high" risk of dying on the operation table.

Meanwhile, even if that doesn't happen, an op with the ascites and the blood results remain the same, my fate will also remain the same.

I don't want to die, not now. I cry a lot, don't get much sleep, have no strength, but so want to remain optimistic.

Even if no-one replies, I had to get it out.

Aw man MrC, so sorry to hear that. I honestly don't know what to say as it sounds terrible and I have no experience that could help you. It sounds so impotent to say, but I'm hoping for the best for you.

It’s difficult to know what to say, Mr C, other than if we could all collectively gather around you and give you our gentle warmth and care, I am 100% certain that everyone here would.

Can the doctor give you something for the hernia pain? The measurement that’s too high: did you have the impression that the doctor didn’t believe you were at full abstention from alcohol? If so, is it possible to see another doctor, explain the situation, and ask if they can do the drain you talk of to give you a better and healthier chance with the operation?

I’m sure you have thought through all the possibilities and scenarios. The only thing I can think is to try another doctor because the variance in care is huge.

On a more simplistic note, I’m thinking of you, and do often. It’s so difficult to know what the ‘right’ thing to say is, and there may not be one, but I’m sending my love and hope for you xx

I also have no practical advice, but I’m very sorry to hear you’re in pain and the prognosis is difficult. I hope they manage to find a way to help you. I’ll be thinking of you.

Gah! *massive hugs*

Crossing everything for you. Hang in there.

Mr C. I have nothing helpful to offer except to say that whenever this thread has a new message in it, it's the first one I go to.

Sorry to hear you're in pain, and that is a horrible diagnosis to deal with. It sounds, and this is only based on what you've said there, as if a withdrawal in hospital is your only route to getting treatment, is that right? That doesn't sound good for all sorts of reasons, but I hope a course of action comes clear soon. All the best.

I also have nothing to offer except my best wishes, and I hope everything works out for you in the best way possible.

Really sorry to read this. Best wishes.
And if posting here helps you unload or just process stuff please continue to do so. We're here for you.

@Dimrill - I'm going to use you as an example of what I think about all these posts. I know people say they don't know what to say, but the very fact that they've taken the time and the effort to post really does make a difference. Of course none of you can help me physically, but the positive effect on my state of mind can't be underestimated. I thank you all, including you Dimrill x

@Mimi - you always say the right thing, and thanks for that. You're right that it might be worth seeking a second opinion and the the differences in opinion among doctors (makes sense, they're only people like the rest of us). When I had the general anaesthetic last year opinion among the docs was 50/50 on whether I needed a transfusion of thrombocytes/platelets. One said no problem, the next said no way.

As far as pain relief goes, certain meds are not good for the liver and others often don't work, as a broken liver doesn't absorb them into the system. I even have an opiate here, but those scare the shit out of me.

It did cross my mind that the surgeon might not have believed me, but I wouldn't blame her for thinking that. Surgeons are busy people and have to work to a tough timetable. She was quick, sharp and brutally honest. I certainly got the message when it came to dying on the operating table. I usually use humour for my own sanity in these situations, but that just wasn't funny.

Thanks for your input Meems, it was very helpful x

@myp - thanks for that, your words mean alot to me.

@Goddess Jasmine - massive hugs right back at you.

@markg - thanks,mate, much appreciated.

@JBR - I think you're right, the confusing thing is how do I withdraw from something I'm not doing? But if it's the only way, I'll do it. Another issue for me, apart from being killed on the op table, is my annoying extreme social anxiety. Hospital rooms tend to be two-patient affairs over here and I can't bear the thought of sharing (for many reasons, for example privacy, leaping out of ned with night cramps (which is why I'm writing this at stupid o' clock, incidentally) and liver-related, um, bowel issues). As you can guess, the hospitals are full of Covid patients, so the chances of paying for a single room are slim.

Thank you so much for your message, it all helps, trust me.

@Joans - Your best wishes are already an offer. Give GJ a big hug.

@Kern - yes it really does help. "Processing" is a good choice of word. So is "unloading" come to think of it. And for that I thank you.

I hope I haven't missed anyone. What you've all done is beautiful and noble thing, and totally helpful in keeping me optimistic against alll the odds. I love you all.

It's worth being worried about opiate painkillers but if they've been prescribed for you and you're in pain, please use them. They'll give you respite and by crikey it sounds like you need that.

I know what you mean, but I still see the opiates as absolute last resort - I've resorted to them twice in the last year, and really didn't like the side effects (nausea, dizziness, knocking you out and disorientation). It gave you the impression that this is some seriously powerful shit. After your post just now, I took a look at the box, and behind the brand name hides morphine...bloody hell...

The nausea passes once you've taken them for a few days. I'd suggest taking them for a couple of days running at a time, then re-evaluate it in a week or two. They wouldn't have been prescribed if you didn't really need them, and the benefits far outweigh the risks for you at the moment. My experience here comes from my Wife taking Tramadol daily for the last five years, so I can at least help you with that

There’s anti nausea meds that can be taken alongside morphine.

Wishing you the very best as always, MrC.

Cheers Zardoz, always good to hear from you (and Dimrill - my reply to your last comment appears not to have made it to reality).

I'll have a think about the anti-nausea meds - thing is I'm already taking a sackful of pills every day, could do without any extras.

Next step is trying to get hold of my GP to see what he thinks - we called him last Thursday and arranged a call back that never came. I know he's not in the surgery on Mondays, so it'll have to be tomorrow.

Deeply sorry to hear what you're going through MrC, I can't imagine the emotions you must be feeling right now and the pain your experiencing. My thoughts and best wishes are with you, that things work out for you and that you can soon look back on this as just an unhappy memory. Big hugs and hold fast.

I'm very sorry to hear of these recent developments Mr C. TO echo what Dimrill said, very strong painkillers don't take too long to acclimatise to and the benefits would outweigh the yucky feelings after the first day or two. Not something you want to be relying on though.

Can you get support from a medical counsellor who might be able to help you explore alternative doctors or alternative treatments/therapy?

I was on oramorph for a few months following an operation, and took anti-nausea tablets too. 'Luckily' I was completely laid up so didn't have to function as normal but there was no withdrawal from it when I stopped. Not sure how much help that is to you, just posted to say I'd take any help being offered to you mate. Just a temporary crutch.

Very sorry to hear this MrC. I can't offer anything but thoughts and words of encouragement. Sounds like a horrible setback in a journey that's had challenge enough already. Hope you get to kick the hernia where it hurts.

@Pete - it's a huge pleasure to hear from you, as what I regard as one of the big brains on here. Or at least an artist, which I was too, unfotunate not the right kind of artist. See? I haven't entirely lost my sense of humour yet. Thank you so much - I also hope I can look back on this from a different perpective x

@sdg - same goes for you, unless of course you mean alternatives in the sense of homeopathy and the like. Otherwise I'll look into all options, and thanks for your kindness x.

@Zardoz - you're a good mood machine, mate. I have no idea what oramorph is, sounds like a baddie from Red Dwarf. But I do take what you say seriously. Cheers, mate!

@Findus Fop - you've already been and continue to be a big help, and for that I thank you. With the name Findus Fop, I feel I'm missing something obvious - maybe you can clear that up - or not, it's probably my job to work it out..

Oramorph (or however it’s spelled) is a liquid morphine solution.

Top stuff that is. I hurt my neck pretty bad once and the pain was so bad they gave me that. I wouldn't say that it totally gets rid of pain, but that you just couldn't give a crap about it.

BTW MrC I am reading this thread and the updates. It's just one of those things that is highly unusual for me. IE, I am totally lost for words. I don't drink, but with life being what it is I can totally understand why people would. I gave up drinking when I was initially put on anti depressants about 20 years ago as they never played well with alcohol. Since then the drugs have just gotten stronger and stronger to the point where I don't drink at all. I'm sorry you are going through this. Even though "sorry" just seems nowhere near enough

Trust me John, "sorry" is more than enough. Thank you.

Your story reminds me a bit of a dental op I had many, many moons ago. They gave me intravenous valium - I was still awake, but not giving a damn. Felt like ten minutes, but was actually an hour and a half.

Ask your doctor about oramorph if your current drugs don’t play well. I’ve also taken it, and I didn’t find that it altered my mental state *at all*, and just acted as a painkiller. Obviously we all react to drugs differently and it might just be finding what works for you.. I’ve been given prescribed Oramorph after a couple of operations, and they also prescribed it to me it after childbirth (though I refused it then as I was breastfeeding and didn’t want any drugs in my system.)

I'm a budget dandy, a cut-price bounder, a Poundland prince, a Findus Fop.

Thanks Mimi, you deliver alot of common sense and logic.

It's all about prioritising at the moment. The pain is a big issue, for sure, but even more critical was the surgeon demanding the impossible with the blood numbers (as I mentioned before, they have wibbled and wobbled in the last five+ years, but always in the same ballpark, so there are no miracle improvements on the cards any time soon). Your other idea of a second opinion makes sense under the circumstances. I know the docs have to warn you about the risks of any procedure, but no-one wants to go into an op with a 60+% chance of death. I know I bloody don't.

You'll never believe it, but I didn't understand a single word of that. Your poetry might need a bit of work

Absolutely. Your priorities are 100% understandable and the ultimate thing here. Pain can make those decisions worse, sometimes making decisions riskier, but you will understand your limits on that far better than any doctor and certainly better than any of us. Keep going a day at a time, MrC x

Lord no, when I have a medical problem I want science and drugs.

Actually, that sounds like a good day regardless of my physical condition.

Glad to hear that - needless to say I totally agree with you.

You're really good at this rational thinking lark, you have a large chunk of respect from me.

I don't want to make any bad decisions for obvious and non-trivial reasons. It's a bit tricky when you get mixed messages, though - maybe I need a third and fourth opinion as well. I agree that (usually) you know your limits best, although you can still be wrong. Docs sometimes have a one-size-fits-all approach, so you always have to filter the information.

I'd say it's probably more like one hour at a time, but I can't say how much I appreciate your very helpful input x.

I know a few of you appreciate the occasional update (I really don't want to overdo it), but I have a small one.

Spoke to my GP the other day and he reckons I should play around with the dosages of the various water pills (rare to hear a doc say something like that) to try and find a balance between the cramps and the ascites. He's also well aware of the risks the surgeon mentioned with ops. He thinks I should give that a go until mid-March and see what I can achieve, then make another decision from there. You can sort of measure the ascetes by your weight and I've managed a huge...drumroll...100g reduction so far. I know I have a few tablets of another water pill called something like Lasix - haven't used that in a long time, and I remember it being effective, but likely to cause cramps. I'll probably have to give it a go at some point. Btw, about the cramps, they're not the same as what we all know from cycling/running/walking a bit too far. I don't want to exaggerate, but agony would be fair word to put to it - that's when your optimism fails and you have those "kill me now" moments.

Here's a funny thing, while I'm here. Probably makes no sense, but in the quieter moments I find myself stepping outside of all this and looking at it from some almost scientific perspective. It's rather odd, almost lke looking at a kind of documentary of yourself. Told you it wouldn't make much sense.

Well, aside from the agony (!), that does sound hopeful - from your previous post, it sounded like you weren't being listened to, whereas this is the opposite of that, even if it's only perhaps going to lead to a marginal gain. But having someone suggest things does, I hope, feel more like they're working for you.

On with the experiment, I say.

Cheers, JBR. That's pretty accurate, as this time it was my GP, who is great. I wish he wasn't so close to retirement.

The weight was down by around half a kilo this morning. It all counts.

@mrC Just checking in to see how you’re doing at the moment. Hoping for news you’re doing as well as possible x

Hey all,

It's sad news I'm afraid. I've spoken to Hanna this morning and she has asked me to update you as promised.

Colin was discharged from hospital a week ago, He came home initially thinking he could get a little better as he definitely felt better after blood transfusions and so on. Unfortunately his health went down quickly due to his liver slowly failing and he has died this morning at home.

I have sent my condolences and let Hanna know that we were very grateful for him sharing his story with us and that it had given some of us something to think about. His story touched us, and he will be missed.

Take care MrC, no more pain and suffering now. I hope you are at peace.

That is really sad news. As you said his suffering has stopped.

ah man. Very sorry to hear that. Godspeed, MrC. You brought some much needed personal perspective to myself, which I will always be grateful for.